A MARTÍNEZ, HOST:
President Trump says his envoy, Steve Witkoff, will soon head back to Moscow for another round of talks with Russian President Vladimir Putin. Coming up, we'll speak with Ukraine's ambassador to the U.S. about the ongoing negotiations. First, the meeting in Moscow comes as Trump says he's closing in on a negotiated deal to end the war in Ukraine. Yet questions hover over Witkoff's role as a mediator, following leaked transcripts of his interactions with key Kremlin officials. To dive into this a little bit more, we're joined by NPR's Charles Maynes from Moscow. So, Charles, let's start off with this latest U.S. peace plan.
CHARLES MAYNES, BYLINE: Yeah. Sure, A. You know, Witkoff will come to Moscow sometime next week to meet with Putin to talk about the plan. And he's really seeking Putin's approval or at least reaction to this draft U.S. proposal that initially offered terms favorable to Moscow, but has since been fine-tuned - that, according to the White House - with input from Europe and Ukraine. And what that means is that probably a lot of the things that Moscow liked about the plan, such as the Ukraine giving up territory to Russia that Moscow's forces don't currently control, are probably gone. But the truth is we don't know the final details, and neither do the Russians. Top people at the foreign ministry, however, have made clear that any significant changes in Ukraine's interests would make the revised plan a nonstarter. So Witkoff really has his work cut out for him.
MARTÍNEZ: Well, especially given that Bloomberg report about that initial U.S. plan that Witkoff promoted that - you know, it was heavily influenced by Moscow.
MAYNES: Yeah, exactly. And that Bloomberg report really appeared to show what many already suspected - that Russia had a significant role in shaping this initial Trump peace plan and that Witkoff was working closely - critics would say too closely - with his Kremlin counterparts, a special envoy, Kirill Dmitriev, and a presidential aide, Yury Ushakov. The calls show Witkoff in particular giving advice on how and when Putin should engage with Trump for maximum effect, including to apparently undermine Ukrainian leader Volodymyr Zelenskyy ahead of a key trip he was making to the White House last month. And yet Trump seemed to play this down. Here he is on Air Force One yesterday.
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PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: That's what a dealmaker does. You got to say, look, they want this. You've got to convince them of this. You know, that's a very standard form of negotiation.
MAYNES: Now, A, I should add that the Russians involved here have also commented. Dmitriev called the transcript a fake. Ushakov, however, acknowledged that he regularly holds talks with Witkoff - including, he added, on WhatsApp, the implication here that some of those conversations might have been intercepted.
MARTÍNEZ: OK. And assuming the conversations are real, do we have any idea who would be behind the leak?
MAYNES: Well, the Kremlin spokesman, Dmitry Peskov, noted that whether or not these leaks are genuine that the list of those against U.S.-Russian cooperation is long. Let's listen.
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DMITRY PESKOV: (Speaking Russian).
MAYNES: So here, Peskov says that this peace process by the U.S. is underway, and it's a serious one involving President Trump and Putin and others. And as a result, there are people who will stop at nothing to undermine it. Now, as to who that might be, it's really an equal-opportunity speculation situation. I mean, Europeans, Ukrainians, of course, some Americans and even hard-line Russians have been unhappy about Trump's attempts at detente with Moscow.
MARTÍNEZ: I guess if undermining the peace plan was indeed the goal, I mean, is it working? Or has it worked?
MAYNES: Well, I mean, some Republicans are already calling for Witkoff's resignation. And that's, again, Republicans. And we'll have to see if his portfolio as a mediator is somehow reduced going forward. But in a way, you know, it may not matter, just in the sense that this document that Witkoff is accused of helping promote, really, that was tilted in Russia's favor - it's already going - undergoing significant revisions. It's no longer the one that everyone's focused on.
MARTÍNEZ: That's Charles Maynes in Moscow. Thanks a lot, Charles.
MAYNES: Thank you. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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