© 2024 Maine Public

Bangor Studio/Membership Department
63 Texas Ave.
Bangor, ME 04401

Lewiston Studio
1450 Lisbon St.
Lewiston, ME 04240

Portland Studio
323 Marginal Way
Portland, ME 04101

Registered 501(c)(3) EIN: 22-3171529
Play Live Radio
Next Up:
0:00
0:00
0:00 0:00
Available On Air Stations
Scroll down to see all available streams.
106.5 WMEF-FM in Fort Kent is off the air for needed maintenance and upgrades including a new antenna installation. This work is estimated to last thru Friday. We apologize for the disruption.

U.S. Senate candidate interviews: Jason Cherry, Demi Kouzounas, David Costello

Photos of Jason Cherry, Demi Kouzounas, David Costello
Maine Public

These interviews were pre-recorded; no calls will be taken.

Earlier in the week, eight of the nine candidates on the ballot to represent Maine in the U.S. Senate or one of Maine’s two Congressional seats joined Jennifer Rooks for a Your Vote 2024 interview.

This show features interviews with the three candidates seeking the U.S. Senate seat currently held by Sen. Angus King: Jason Cherry, David Costello, Demi Kouzounas.

Lightly edited transcripts of the interviews will appear below as they're available.

Jason Cherry: Independent, former criminal defense attorney and FBI special agent

Rooks: Tell us why you're running for the U.S. Senate.

Cherry: I've been in public service basically since the start of my — once I received a college degree, I was a conservation officer. I was a criminal defense attorney. I was an FBI agent for over 20 years. And the first one is just motivation. I enjoy public service. I believe that it is a duty, a very honorable duty, especially when executed appropriately. I'm running, particularly, as you know, as a Gen Xer. I've got concerns about where the baby boomer generation is going, as far as the stability of Social Security, but for all of us, especially those generations younger than us, that you know, are apparently struggling, very apparently struggling with the sharp rise in living costs, and then also housing, education, debt. So there's a number of younger voters who signed my ballot, and I want to be able to present their arguments, but also, as well as others. I'm running as an executive-style representative and an executive style representative is just like an attorney, where each individual inherits a portion of government power and they need to hear from both sides before making rational decisions.

If elected the U.S. Senate, as you well know, Sen. Angus King caucuses with Democrats. Would you caucus with Republicans or Democrats?

I would speak with both — if I'm honored enough to be elected — I would speak with both Sen. King and Sen. Susan Collins to discuss the pros and cons of their caucuses and what committee positions that they're able to provide us. As an independent one of the unique abilities is to negotiate between the two parties and to see what committee positions they will provide for me to caucus. Now the danger, of course, is if I caucus with Republicans, I'll be seen as a Republican. If I caucus with the Democrats, I'll be seen as a Democrat. And that's the unfortunate choice that we have. It's more of a utilitarian question as who can provide the best committees, and also, who are going to allow me to make independent decisions for Maine and not try to pressure me with two-party, narrow agendas.

Jason, on your website, you call for, and I'm quoting here, "reform for true government ownership." What do you mean by that?

Well, as a legal instructor, I taught new agents criminal law, which is based upon constitutional law. So I've studied James Madison's notes. I know that the underpinnings of our country were diverse. There were some people that wanted to a closed republic. There were some people that wanted a democratic republic. And what we have right now is a political system where it seems immutable. There are no abilities to make changes. So with the 9% approval rate and no way to change any of the issues that don't work or that create a bad government, lack of accountability, lack of efficiency, lack of competency, only half of the senators have a law degree, which you would hopefully need to understand legislation and the concepts of overbreadth and vagueness, we just don't have the highest quality representatives. And as a owner of government, you want the same as a conventional owner of any property. You want under the old law of agency for your representatives to be loyal to you, to be competent, to be transparent. And so right now, we're operating under a constitutional mandate, or a constitutional framework in which representatives don't have to have the economic and legal skills before they obtain a position. They can hold on to those positions like the nobles of old until, you know, it's not the people who take power at times, it's the hospice nurse. We also need to have greater ethical constraints on creating legislation and being able to trade office stocks and bonds. So we need a great deal of measures that would reflect what a conventional owner would want, and not a constitutional owner of government. We have way too much corruption, we have way too much lack of accountability and way too much inefficiency for us to be true owners. And so we need to enact measures to establish those four principal objectives that any conventional owner would want.

All right. Well, it sounds like one of the things you would advocate for is term limits.

Yes, absolutely, for all three branches.

Let me ask you about some issues that are on the minds of many Americans right now. One is the war in Ukraine. Do you support the level of support that so far the United States has given to Ukraine.

At this point, I do, absolutely. We must oppose the Putin regime. I myself actually speak Russian. I've been over to Russia and have been actually trained by Ukrainians. So the Ukrainians are some of the closest family members that Russia has, and that regime has them killing their own family members. We cannot allow that to continue.

And what about the conflict right now in Israel? Do you support the level of support that the U.S. is providing for Israel, and do you believe the U.S. has a role in ending the conflict?

I am disappointed in the lateness of food and other supports to the Gazans, the refugees in Gaza. I'm very disappointed in the role that the United States has taken, because, you know, we do have a desire and a role to protect Israel, but we need to do it under circumstances that will establish long-lasting, stable peace for those individuals who want peace. So as a member of the Senate, I would attempt to obtain international accord in placing a UN buffer zone between both parties, I would bring forth delegates, the same delegation, for example, in Bosnia and Northern Ireland, individuals who have experience dealing with religious conflicts, and individuals who know that the cornerstone of a lasting peace is mutual respect and fair treatment, and so that UN body needs to be there for the safety of the people of Gaza, for the Palestinians and for the Israelis. Right now, that ants nest has been overturned. There is no way to deescalate through escalation, the path that's taking now is going to result in a war where Israel is not going to be safe. We need to step in, and the United States needs to take a leadership role in that.

We're approaching the one year anniversary of the shootings in Lewiston, Maine, where 18 people were killed, 13 injured. And I'm wondering in the wake of that if you believe there need to be changes in federal firearms laws, specifically an assault weapon ban, as the U.S. used to have.

I'm in favor of stronger red flag laws, where the individual is reported if they are a danger to themselves and others and have firearms. And ... due process measures that allow them to retain their weapons if the professionals so deem that they are not a danger to themselves and others. As a former FBI agent who worked in Bangor, Maine, working on the drug squad, the other issue is private sales of firearms. We are a trafficking state. Firearms are a commodity. The gang members and other criminals come up here, they can grab six or seven weapons, exchange them for drugs, and there's no tracking of that. So we need an application that makes it easy for private gun sales to occur, that they can ensure that the individual who purchases that firearm is able to do so legally. So that loophole cannot continue to exist in Maine. Otherwise, we're fueling a great deal of murder and mayhem throughout the country. We are literally arming criminals up here with guns bought online. We need to have some responsibility. And for the guns rights advocates that have asked me these questions, I am in support of the Second Amendment. I understand that the pinnings of democracy relied upon a, you know, a balance of power between individuals and particularly the hoplites that were able to arm themselves against tyrants who would use the army against them. And our ancestors, the poor Europeans from war-torn Europe, understood that they needed to be armed. So while I agree with greater red flag laws and also private sales, I am not in favor of the prohibitions on assault weapons. I believe that if the other side that believes in gun control could picture that Jan. 6 took off and that they were under a threat by weapons, forced to do the things that that group wanted to enact in an insurrection, they're going to want those weapons back. We cannot guarantee the safety of individuals without arming our citizens, to the point that the U.S. government has to think about the tyranny. You look at Russia, you look at China. There's a reason why white panel vans do not pick up citizens off the street here. And I think that the underpinnings of the Second Amendment, the rationale that went into it, are not understood very well these days. But at the same time, to protect the Second Amendment, we need reasonable gun control measures, because the next generation is seeing a number of school shootings, and that's how they see it. We need greater mental health crisis in the school system. We don't arm teachers. As a firearms trainer, that is this ridiculous proposition. We need to get the at-risk youth before they become active shooters.

Some Republicans in Congress would like to have a federal abortion ban. Some, many Democrats, would like to see reproductive rights, the kind that were under Roe v. Wade when it was in effect, codified in federal law. Where do you stand?

I stand in the role that the federal government was made to be, and that is to form a consensus and allow the states to expand rights. Like the Constitution — the Constitution represents the minimum threshold of rights, and each state can expand those. We should take that same framework and use it for the abortion platform, where the federal government would set, based upon both scientific and input from different communities, the minimum number of months that you need to have before you can have a lawful abortion, and then under the circumstances such as rape and other types of violence or health or medical needs, and then allow the states to either expand upon that or keep it as is. And so let's say they come up with 15 weeks for legal, and Maine, through initiatives and ballots to the people — not the parties, not the legislature — they vote on public initiatives. I have great concerns about the two-party system's ability to represent all of the Mainers, all of the citizens. So these votes should come from individuals on whether or not they want to expand that federal minimal threshold or not.

No matter who wins the presidency, do you believe you could work with either Kamala Harris or Donald Trump effectively?

I would be able to work with both. I would make myself work with both. But given some of the rhetoric that Donald Trump has said about the FBI and law enforcement, I have some concerns about whether or not he will uphold the law. There are a number of very respectable military officials out there that have stated that they have deep concerns about his ability to obey the law and our constitution. So I would work with him to the degree that I could. But the same goes for the Democrat side. I don't have a lot of trust in the upper echelons of both political parties, even though I would here in the state level.

OK, and finally, why don't I ask you, Jason, about Social Security? What do you think needs to happen to protect it in the future?

Well, I am not in favor of — and I can't get any articles on Angus King's position, but 11 years ago and repeatedly, he has wanted to raise the eligibility to 70 years old. And that is for a population that is dealing with sharp living costs and debts, and now they're expected to save for retirement and live until they're 70 years old, even those individuals that are blue collar. And so I would be more in favor of investment vehicles like annuities-types markets, where they are protected but enforced with state and private right of action. I think after 2011, there's a lot of distrust of the financial district because they won't be held accountable, and so that if we are going to put the future of retirement in some hands, we need strong, draconian and actual jail time for those who commit fraud.

Demi Kouzounas: Republican, dentist, Army veteran, former head of the Maine GOP

Rooks: Why don't I start with your priorities? If elected to the U.S. Senate, what would be the first piece of legislation you would introduce, and why?

Kouzounas: Well, I think we have a lot of issues going on. I think probably closing the border would be one of my top issues, because taking a trip down there, I saw the humanitarian crisis where, you know, women and children are trafficked, and the fentanyl issue's a huge issue for me. I would try to deal with expanding veteran care, especially mental health. I think that's a large issue. Mental health and addiction as a whole is a huge issue that has not been addressed well enough. And the cost of living, I think the cost of living has become a big problem across the United States, but especially here in Maine, because we in the state of Maine, we need to heat, we need to travel. We — you know, resources are always scarce for us, and so cost of living has put a big burden in the state of Maine.

Would you support continuing aid to Ukraine in its fight against Russia?

Well, I do support, you know, the aid to Ukraine in its fight for Russia. As a veteran, I served during '81-'84, during the Cold War, and we were actually, at that time, still in war, Cold War, with Russia. So, serving there, it changed my perspective. I think that peace through strength is very important, but I will say we keep on handing money over to the Ukraine, we don't have enough transparency and we don't have a plan to end the war. I'm not for endless wars. So what we need to do is probably be a little bit more transparent to the public and address the issue that — how long are we going to continue this fight? We need to have plans to exit this war.

Your website talks about out-of-control pricing and inflationary spending. As a U.S. senator, what steps would you take to address the inflation that you are talking about?

First of all, we're about $35 trillion now in deficit, and now we're spending a lot of money just paying the interest rates on that deficit, and that's inflationary in itself. We've done too much spending and not enough, you know, corralling back and being more strategic in how we spend our money. So the first thing I would do is look at where our spending has occurred, where we can cut costs. In the last — we spent more, probably, in the last four years, with bills like, you know, the American Rescue Plan, the infrastructure bill, which, I am for infrastructure, but just not all the extra padding in that bill. And, of course, the Inflation Reduction Act, which was a Green New Deal. All of that cost $10 trillion. My opponent, Angus King, voted for all of them, and was the deciding vote, in actuality, because it only passed by one vote in the American Rescue and the Green New Deal. We need to really put stops and start looking at our budget, because we got another huge hurricane barreling into Florida as we speak, and we're worried that maybe FEMA will run out of money. We're going to have to appropriate more money towards that too.

I have to ask you, do you believe that the 2020 presidential election was a free and fair election?

I do believe that the 2020 election was a free and fair election. I think there were inconsistencies. And when the public is concerned about voting, that's that's a cry from our population saying we don't feel safe. We need to feel safe. We need to have our election system be more transparent. For the state of Maine, because I'm only going to speak for the state of Maine, I think we have one of the best elections process because we have paper ballots. Our counters, our computers, are not connected by the internet, so there cannot be foul play. And I've been involved with many recounts, and I have to tell you, in all the recounts I've been involved with, we're off by two or three or four votes, not by many. So I feel Maine for sure, and I can only attest to that, has a great election process.

Oct. 25 marks the one year anniversary of the Lewiston shooting. In the wake of that shooting, do you support legislation to ban or limit assault weapons?

Yeah, I've been asked that about guns. I personally don't think guns kill people. People kill people. We have a mental health crisis we haven't addressed. In Robert Card's case there was no institution to put him here in Maine. He was in New York, where they have a red flag law. They didn't take away his guns. They let him out early after two and a half weeks. He came to Maine. His family was very concerned about his mental health and the fact that he was hearing, supposedly, voices. They didn't — the state of Maine, we have laws of the books for that — didn't take away his weapons. And he then turned around through basically his illness and killed all those people and then himself. You know, we can take guns away. We can be in a country like, I don't know, Russia or Israel, that doesn't have a lot of weapons. But still there's mass shootings. Because people that are law abiding will always follow the law. People who are mentally ill or not law abiding will not follow the law. We need to do better at really working with the laws in place to keep our society safer.

Your website mentions that you would push for bipartisan solutions. But you know, everybody knows that there's a very hyperpartisan environment right now in Washington. Where do you think there's room for a bipartisan solution, or bipartisan solutions? Where do you see that space?

I think it depends on the individual. For example, Sen. King claims he's an independent, but he votes 98.5% of the time with, in this case, the Biden administration. So he may claim he's bipartisan, but he's not. I can tell you categorically that I will be more bipartisan than he will. I will be probably more towards the Sen. Collins way of voting, which is I will be more concerned for Mainers and what we can do to improve Maine life, than I will be concerned about going along to getting along or being a career politician. I believe in term limits. I will be — only if I do get elected, only serve two terms, and my job is to help Mainers, not to help an administration.

What would you do as a U.S. senator to help preserve Social Security for those who will retire in the future?

Great question. My husband will be applying for Social Security in January, and I think Social Security and Medicare are very important issues, because it's a promise. We made a promise to these people that were paying in, like I did, that we will be there for them when they retire. I think we haven't put the money aside in a preserved way to make sure that it would be there for the future. And so I blame, basically, [the] administration for overspending, not being able to make sure that the money would be there. In this direction we're going, Social Security's going to be insolvent in 10 years. So spending is very important. Finally, COLA. Let's talk about the cost of limit adjustment. It only allowed for 3% and our inflation is up to 20%, so we never kept up with inflation. So most people — Social Security and Medicare at this point — have less money than they had before. I will promise to preserve that and adjust the cost of living so that more money goes to Social Security.

But how do you think it could be preserved? Do you, for example, favor raising the retirement age, raising the cap of the amount of money for which people — amount of income for which people can pay into Social Security, will pay into Social Security.

Well, the money that we pay into Social Security goes into the federal government. If the federal government continues spending the way it is, it will not have enough money to pay the recipients. That money was already paid in and should be there and solvent for the future of our retirees. We have to stop spending so the money exists there for the recipients, and we also have to adjust for cost of living. It's a promise we've made to folks. I paid in plenty of money myself. It should be there when the time comes that I retire.

Do you feel confident that whoever is elected president, you'll be able to work with him or her?

That's part of being bipartisan and only being concerned with what's best for Mainers and not for your career. I am not a career politician. My concern is only for Mainers, for my family, for my sisters, for my grandchildren. My concern is to make sure that I represent Maine. I will work with whichever administration wins this election to make sure that we're there for the people of Maine.

As you've traveled the state and met with voters, are there any issues that have emerged that you realize are going to be important issues in the future that perhaps have not been in the past, and what is your stand on them? I don't want to put words in your mouth. I don't want to suggest issues. But what are you hearing from Mainers, and what do you think is going to have to be a priority, even though it has not been on Capitol Hill in the past?

Interesting, energy costs is No. 1. And the most No. 1 issue that people talk about [is] electricity with now subsidizing, you know, wind and solar, and it's put a huge burden onto people's, you know, electric bills. I know people have said, you know, in the wintertime, I closed down my house, and yet I get this, you know [...] electric bill. You know, we were pushing for heat pumps, but again, we need energy, electricity to run those, and so people are fearful of getting rid of their wood stove or pellet stoves or furnaces, because they they're concerned that the costs are just getting too expensive. Housing has become a humongous problem, as we all are hearing about it. I talked to one lady, she's a nurse, her husband's a physical therapist. They have one child. They want to expand their family, but they have a two-bedroom apartment, and they're spending $2,500 a month for living costs, which is very, very expensive, and they can't add to their family because of housing, and that's become an issue in itself. And I think health care and mental health are huge issues for me. As you know, I'm a dentist. I've been involved with a lot of nonprofits to help with access to care. And if we can't get dentists, doctors, nurses, hygienists interested, because there's no place for them to live, it will ration health care. I know I see it. I was actually on faculty to UNE dental school and have trained 25 dentists myself, and a lot of them have left the state because young people today do travel, and they'll go to a state that's less expensive and housing is more affordable.

Here on Maine Calling, we're doing a yearlong series, and probably longer than a year, on the housing crisis. And I want to return to that. What is the role of the federal government and U.S. Congress, in helping bring more housing to Maine and other places with a housing shortage?

Yeah, it seems to be a huge problem throughout the country. I think first of all, you've gotta look at regulation, make sure that we don't overregulate to make it difficult for people to develop their properties for housing. I think that the cost of housing has gone too high because of inflation. Maybe we can find more innovative ways to build houses less expensive. We need to really look into the trades, educate young people in the trades because — and I can tell you, just talking to my friends and that are physicians and dentists, I'm thinking some people, like plumbing, electricians, might make more than we do, and don't have the $700,000 you know, student loan burden and afterwards. I mean, the trades is very lucrative. We need more people in the trades. We need to train more people, apprentice more people. These are issues that we can help nationally and statewide. But we do need more housing, and we have to — probably, because I tell everybody, I said, 'Maine is such a beautiful place, everybody wants to come to Maine to live, and that's why we may have a housing problem.' I don't know, but we do need more houses for — especially in just in my little world in health care, health care providers, dental providers, mental health providers, we need that in the state.

What do you believe the U.S. can do to help bring peace to Israel and its neighbors?

I 100% support Israel. It is the only democracy in the Middle East, and it is also a strong ally of the United States, and it is trying to exist. But what we did — well, I should say I do, but our government did, and Sen. King did — is appease Iran. It gave Iran a lot of money. It lifted the oil embargoes, which it now sells a lot of its oil to China. It has become very wealthy in the last few years, and has then since become — basically helped the Hamas, Hezbollah and Houthis, which are terrorist organizations, to then turn around and attack Israel. And Israel has now got a multi-front fight ahead of itself. And it is a huge issue. I think what we have to do is support Israel in its fight to exist. We need to get our hostages back. Back. I mean, four of those hostages are Americans. We need to be over there fighting, and we need to be strong with countries like Iran, who are not there helping, but they're actually, they're causing more issues. We probably should, you know, be very strong, put an embargo against Iran because it is within weeks of having a nuclear weapon, which is exactly what we don't want.

Final question, many other Republicans would like to see a national abortion ban. Would you support that if it came before the U.S. Senate?

I've told anyone that will listen, I am pro choice. And I'll tell you why I'm pro choice. I myself was assaulted, sexually assaulted in college. Did not tell my parents and my family — my parents would have taken me right out of the University of Maine Orono college. And so I'm like a lot of survivors that didn't talk about these things. I myself also struggled with getting pregnant for my youngest, and had to work with a fertility specialist and have procedures done. So I know both sides. It's a very personal and difficult decision. I think that it should be left between the woman, her family, her husband or spouse or partner, and her doctor. But I will say, if the pregnancy needed to end in the late term of area of a pregnancy, I personally feel strongly, if the baby's viable, we should be talking about not abortion, but by giving birth, and if the mother couldn't care for the baby, maybe talking about adoptions and working with adoptions. I have so many friends that would have wanted to adopt a baby. Sen. King feels that there should be no exceptions, and even if the baby was viable, we should be allowed to abort a viable fetus, even in late terms. And I don't agree with that. I think that we have to be reasonable. We should always be compassionate and always support life whenever possible.

David Costello: Democrat, held state and federal government positions

Rooks: I'll start with the big question, why are you running for Congress?

Costello: Well, I believe Congress is a bit of a mess right now, and I really think the only way we can fix it is really to look at substantial governing practices and institutional reforms. And I say that in large part because I don't believe we're getting the kind of work done we need to as it relates to reducing the cost of living for Maine families or families across the United States, and other issues, a whole range of issues. And again, I just don't think we're getting the work done.

How do we reduce the cost of living for Maine families?

Well, I think we've put a lot of programs in place. Government has quite an extensive toolkit, but it hasn't done a good job, particularly lately. Congress has done very little lately to really expand and to reinforce the toolkit. And when I say that we've done a number of things over the years, whether it's to increase, you know, minimum wage, established social security, established tax credits for families with children, earned income tax credits for families that are obviously in somewhat distressed by comparison to other middle, and working class families. So there are a lot of government programs, and I think what we need to do is, obviously we need to increase revenue so that we can better resource those programs.

Senator Angus King, who you're challenging, caucuses with the Senate Democrats, can you give us a couple issues where you might vote differently than Senator King?

He talked to Senator Cassidy, or there's been discussions in the past about raising the retirement age for Social Security to 70. I would never do that. I certainly don't believe we need to do that. And I think it'd be costly. It's about a 6% decrease in benefits to average Mainers. So I wouldn't support him there. I think he's been too slow as it comes when it comes to gun safety reforms. For instance, I've supported gun safety gun control legislation since I worked for Ted Kennedy in the 1980s.

So what would you like to see for Gun Safety reform? What would you do in the session if you were able to?

Well, I would certainly support a range of reforms that have been suggested. And Chris Murphy has a great bill, and he's had bills for some time. But the kinds of things I would support, universal background checks, certainly an assault weapon span, safe storage. I would even support efforts to hold gun manufacturers liable for the use of some of the weapons, particularly those military style weapons. I would also support increased funding for mental health services, and community policing. I would support increasing the penalties, the sentencing for for gun violent crimes.

All right, well, I'll ask you, how do we pay for your ideas?

I think there are a number of mistakes we made in terms of of tax cuts. We've given away too much opportunity for revenue to wealthy Americans. Right now we've got a real income gap, a wealth gap in the United States. So I'd certainly roll back the recent Bush and Trump tax cuts on the wealthy. And I think President Biden's put a pretty good proposal together that would do that, as well as efforts by Senator Warren and Senator Sanders. So I would support much of that. And of course, it would. It would fund the kind of programs that that I referenced earlier, even expand universal pre K and aftercare. I mean, as you probably know childcare expenses, it's like funding a child in the first year of of college to just just have them in childcare for a year. So there were a lot of programs, and again, if we're going to be able to expand the programs to the extent that we need to, we need to raise revenue, and in doing so, we're being much more fiscally responsible, and we would start to work to reduce our deficit and ultimately tackle our debt.

If elected to the U.S. Senate, what would be the first piece of legislation you would introduce?

The first piece would be basically a piece of legislation that would look to reform our governmental institutions and practices. I mean, I've got a range of reforms on my website, at costelloforsenate.com, they're not all my ideas. They're ideas that political scientists and economists have been making the case for decades. I think Congress is broken, and we're not going to fix it by simply changing whom we elect every couple of years. We need to really take a hard look at, you know, at basically putting in place legislative and constitutional reforms that will help to, you know, obviously, to make government much more efficient and effective.

What are some of those top line ideas?

Well, the the easy stuff, and you know, this isn't easy, because we haven't succeeded, but to ban filibustering, to end gerrymandering, to to end Senate holds, to put in place serious campaign finance reforms, those, those would be the easiest, but I'd like to go much further than that. I'd certainly like to to put term limits on the Supreme Court, and, quite frankly, even legislators and even age retirement requirements. And what I would do with those senators, Congress people and judges who wanted to continue to serve, I'd establish a an independent, politically unencumbered commission that would allow them to rank and grade government programs, budgets and those kinds of things in a way that, quite frankly, would give greater confidence to the public, the media and others, that the programs either work or they don't work and they're worth investing in.

How do you get other U.S., senators and congressmen to support these reforms that, frankly, take away their power, or some of their power?

Well, I would argue, that it would enhance the their power, because it would allow them to be a more effective governor, you know, governors or people who are involved in administering the government. And I think the vast majority, that's why I would say if, if I were to talk to a colleague, I'd say, well, which particular reform wouldn't you support? And I think the vast majority of Democrats and those that are interested, or, you know, Congress people and senators who are interested in a more effective, more accountable, more democratic government. I think the vast majority would support them. Of course, the challenge would be, well, how do we mobilize the public, the media and the rest of our colleagues to get the work done I'm not underestimating the challenge. I think much of my work in Congress wouldn't be on reforming government, because it would be extremely difficult, and it's the kind of case I'd be making over the years and hoping that particularly young Americans and the public would rally. Because, as you probably know, the vast, vast majority of Americans are crying out for meaningful political change, because I think most Americans understand government isn't working to the extent that it needs to as our collective instrument.

Your website also says you're going to work for a fairer allocation of political power in the U.S. Senate. Explain that? Do you mean California needs more senators and Maine need fewer?

There are a number of ways we could do it, but ultimately, this is where we are. The U.S senate is one of the most obscenely undemocratic institutions in in the world, in that you've got say, like California, that's 70 times larger than Wyoming, and they have the same leveraging cloud. And what you end up with is you end up with the kind of gridlock that we have in Washington as well as you end up with the Supreme Court that we have that is not representative of the interests of the vast majority of Americans. So what I would there are a number of things we could do. I'd love to see a constitutional amendment, although, as you know it, it's almost impossible to amend the United States Constitution. We've had 11,000 proposals over the years, and only 27 have succeeded. But getting back to the Senate, there are a number of ways we could give greater weight to the to a vote or votes from senators from larger states over smaller states. There are ways we could tier the Senate, but I would much rather see a much better constitutional reform. But of course, that will take a lot of time, and if I could do one thing in to reform the constitution, I'd make it easier, although still difficult, to amend the Constitution, because it's almost impossible to update and overhaul the Constitution in a positive way today, and that's really helped hamstring our government.

Let's talk about some of the front and center issues of the day. Do you believe that the U.S. government is on the right track in its level of support for Ukraine?

I think we need to do more. I think the Biden administration has done a very good job in providing assistance, and I think NATO countries are stepping up to the extent that they need to. But of course, there's been some hiccups or holdups in the Congress that were unnecessary. I think it's cost a lot of lives, quite frankly, in Ukraine, in the delay of assistance a while back. And certainly if I were in Congress. I would have been a strong advocate for more urgent and robust aid to Ukraine, because Putin is a thug, as as I know, you know, and his aims are quite frankly, not, not in the best interests of the United States or even any Western country, quite frankly. So I'd be much supportive.

I was just going to move on to the Middle East and the U.S. role in what's going on with Israel and its neighbors.

Well, as you know, it's the anniversary today of that horrific incident in Gaza when Hamas terrorists attacked innocent Israelis and killed over 1200 Israelis and held hostage, and still hold many hostage, over 250 hostages. So what I would say is this is, unfortunately, it's hard to imagine how we end the conflict in not only Gaza now, but in Lebanon, and even with Iran, and Iran obviously is one of the key players in that its proxy Hamas and Hezbollah are doing a lot of its work for them. I've been a strong supporter of Israel, but at the same time, I've always been a strong supporter of a credible two state solution, and even though I've always been a strong supporter of Israel, I've not ever been a strong supporter or a supporter of Netanyahu in the right wing in Israel, I think the hard right in all of these factions and countries, whether it's Iran, whether it's Hezbollah and obviously Hamas or hard right terrorist organizations. It's to the point where the only way we're going to get to a two state solution is that we need to have an immediate ceasefire. And of course, that looks almost impossible now, but to the extent that we can continue to support Arab countries who are willing to go into Gaza to help rebuild and stabilize, but at the same time, we have to continue support Israelis who understand that Netanyahu approaches are not appropriate, that it's indefensible that so many innocent lives in Gaza have been killed, women and children. So it's extremely complex, and it's it's going to take time, but I think the Biden administration, for the most part, has done, you know, their level best in trying to to mitigate the conflict, and I'll continue to support their efforts going forward.

Most voters are saying that their number one issue is inflation. What could you as a U.S. senator do to help curb inflation in America?

Well, the good news is, as you probably know, inflation has now dropped below as a percentage, dropped below 3% and a lot of that work was done by what the Fed was able to do in terms of how it deals with monetary policy. I would say this, because what the Senate can do, and hasn't done, is can do a better job of of dealing with household expenses, helping families with their cost of living, and that's why I'd say the Democratic Party has done a commendable job over history in terms of doing things like increasing the minimum wage, or establishing the minimum wage, expanding Social Security benefits to low income seniors, in particular, providing tax credits to families, low income families, as well as families with children. So what we can do is we can provide more resources to cover the higher living costs, including whether it's transportation costs or groceries or whatever those costs are, by putting more resources into those programs. And of course, as we talked earlier, to fund those programs, we've got to take a look at revenue to honestly fund them, we've really got to take a hard look at revenues as well.

What do you believe needs to be done to preserve and protect Social Security?

Well, I think the easiest thing to do is to raise, as you know, the cap on the payroll tax is $168,000 we need to remove that, so we'd certainly accrue a great deal more revenue by doing that. But at the same time, we can also take a look at at general revenues. If we ever had to, I don't think we'll ever get to the point where we do not have a solvent Social Security trust fund. And if we needed to, we could take general revenue to help supplement the money in there. I'd also support the idea of a sovereign wealth fund. I think we can take additional funding and put it into, quite frankly, the market. As you know, all of the money that goes into Social Security goes into treasury bills, which are extremely secure, but over the last couple of years, the bond market hasn't been strong. It's still safe, but not as strong as equity. So I would look to what most pension programs, state government pension programs do, and put some money into equities as well so we can drive higher returns.

The Republican challenging Angus King is very concerned about the deficit, and I'm wondering if you're concerned by the rising deficit, and if so, what would you do about it?

Well, I would certainly again, claw back those Republican tax cuts which have added billions of dollars to our deficit. So, if they're serious about balancing the budget, they just can't talk about tax cuts. That does the opposite. So I would certainly look to claw back and increase taxes, progressive taxes on high income wealthy Americans and corporations. So that would be the quickest way to get back to a balanced budget, let alone start to, you know, to work at reducing our debt and interest payments on the debt.

All right, as you, I'm sure you know, Kamala Harris and President Biden have proposed codifying reproductive rights through Congress. Would you support that?

Absolutely. I'd certainly support any provisions to guarantee contraceptive care or to provide additional assistance for contraceptive care, Planned Parenthood, those kinds of things.

Stay Connected
Jonathan was born in Monsey, New York. A field trip to Washington, DC when he was in 7th grade started him on his circuitous path to a career in public radio. The trip inspired a love of politics and led to his desire to one day call DC home. After graduating from Grinnell College, he worked on a couple of campaigns in Iowa (presidential and congressional) and moved to Washington, DC.