The past year delivered a lot of big surprises and Rep. Jared Golden's sudden decision to abandon his reelection bid was among them.
Golden's withdrawal is part of a larger trend in Congress. More than 50 current members have announced that they won't seek re election next year. That's more than 10% of Congress, according to NPR's retirement tracker.
Some of these departures are age related. Others are because members are running for governor. But neither of those factors are the case for the 43-year old Golden. He has said hyper-partisanship, the threat of political violence, and the inability to get anything done in the current climate were all contributing factors to his decision.
Maine Public chief politics correspondent Steve Mistler and fellow politics correspondent Kevin Miller recently sat down with Rep. Jared Golden for a lengthy conversation about these factors.
During the conversation, he spoke about the warring factions within the Democratic Party; how some Democrats refuse to recognize the electoral realities of the 2nd Congressional District that he represents; and yes, about that infamous column he wrote before the 2024 election that made so many Democrats angry.
He also had a few things to say about why he drew a primary challenger this year from former Secretary of State Matt Dunlap.
Editor's note: This interview has been lightly edited for clarity.
Steve Mistler: Congressman, thanks for joining us.
Rep. Jared Golden: Thanks. Good to be here.
Steve Mistler: Before we get into your decision, I wonder if you could just sort of take us back to when you were first elected in 2018. Congress was sharply divided the. The partisanship was pretty toxic. Neither the house nor the Senate were especially productive, and Donald Trump as president. But you still decided to run. So what's different about this current moment compared to when you were first elected?
Rep. Jared Golden: Well, I was not incredibly surprised what Congress was like, having worked there as a staff of a senator. I kind of had eyes wide open. I think there's a fair amount of people who get to Congress and are rather surprised how dysfunctional it is, or really is. As bad as it was in 2018-2019, when I first got there, it is worse today, by far, in almost every kind of metric I think I could choose. There are less members of Congress who see positive incentives to work across the aisle, more and more people who think that the way to get attention, or rise up, is to just be kind of the loudest, you know, angriest, most partisan individual on your side of the aisle. I think that I would have said there was like 30 or 40 members of the House between the two parties when I first got there, who were likely to be involved in efforts towards compromise and actually trying to do some good work, or line up work that could get through the Senate with the 60 votes. It used to be that people would want to put together a good bill in the House and say, 'Let's send something over that already has what it takes to get 60 votes.' Now you'll hear people say, whoever's in the majority, let's just go for a really partisan bill. In fact, it'll even be better if the other party doesn't vote for it at all. Maybe that'll increase our leverage in the Senate, etc. So kind of ceding all the compromise over to that side of of the Congress.
Steve Mistler: It sounds like, almost like a perverse incentive to get anything done -- if the goal is to score points or set up for a messaging vote for re-election or something like that.
Rep. Jared Golden: Correct.
Steve Mistler: You're saying that's a lot worse now than it was when in 2018 or really 2019 when you were sworn in.
Rep. Jared Golden: Even among like the members themselves, there is a growing kind of like ugliness to the whole business. I hear more people in my party expressing extreme skepticism and automatic negative assumptions about other members of Congress who are from the Republic Republican Party, always, you know, kind of assuming the worst behind their actions without even having had a conversation -- kind of eye rolling at the thought of attempting to work across the aisle. Just after January 6, things were very bad. Somehow it just keeps getting worse and worse.
Kevin Miller: Yeah, it sounds like you're saying this is a problem on both sides, right? This isn't just a Republican issue, a Democratic issue. The partisan gridlock has gotten worse on both sides.
Rep. Jared Golden: Absolutely.
Kevin Miller: Is it leadership? Where is that coming from?
Rep. Jared Golden: I think it's coming from all around. I think it's members themselves. I think it's the way that leadership tends to play the game. You can look at what happened to (former Republican House Speaker) Kevin McCarthy in the last Congress. Just increasingly we see people being taken out of leadership positions and punished in the House of Representatives for ever working across the aisle. Even now, as Speaker Mike Johnson is trying to reconcile the differences within his own caucus on health care and the ACA subsidies, he's got the Freedom Caucus openly threatening that if he makes any deal with the Democrats to pass something on on health care, that they'll get 12 people to sign a petition to begin a motion to vacate the chair, which would be an effort to remove him from being Speaker. So that was not a normal thing that long ago. Now it's just kind of a standard threat in their caucus. They set the rules up that way themselves. But it's kind of a sign of the times. I think, too, it's fair to say social media, the conversation taking place amongst the entire population, also creates incentives — perverse incentives. In some ways, the body (Congress) reflects the body politic.
Kevin Miller: In your op ed, where you announced that you wouldn't seek another term, you talked about the increasing incivility in politics, often embodied by leaders on both sides. You said the Republican Party has been, quote, hijacked, first by the Tea Party, but then by the MAGA extremists. But you also suggest that the Democratic Party is increasingly allowing extremists to run things. Obviously you think those things have gotten worse during your seven years. Do you see things changing? I guess the question is, how do we get out of that, this mode that we're in right now?
Rep. Jared Golden: I don't know that I have an answer for you there, Kevin. You just need more people who go and do the job with a different set of, you know, goals, I guess. I want to govern, legislate, actually work on issues, get them through into law, which generally means that you have to be willing to work with other people. Increasingly, it seems like a lot of people thrive and find some kind of fulfillment, just in getting a lot of likes on social media, a lot of attention on their Instagram posts. I see a lot of young members now who they almost look like they're auditioning to take your job. They walk around with staff with them and like little backpacks with weird camera arms hanging out of them and stuff. They're all geared up. And it's like a mobile studio for putting out content. And they'll like, come off the floor on a vote that is no surprise to anyone — everyone knew what the outcome was going to be. And they'll like, step out in front of the Capitol and it might be like raining, and they're like, 'I had to brave the storm to come right out and tell you what just took place on the House floor.' It's rather fake. But I think, absent any other way to put your energy towards something positive, that people just they accept what they feel like they can get credit for. So, it's not very hopeful response. But, you know, I had a little tiff with (the liberal advocacy group) Indivisible here in the state of Maine after I spoke at a event for Colby College students. And, you know, I was trying to differentiate between a local Indivisible group where I think probably the volunteers there mean what they say and are fearful about the Trump administration, want to do their part, you know, to give voice to the fears of many people in the country. But when you look at their national leadership and their own founding documents, they literally say, we want to be the Tea Party of the left, which makes their goals different than the goals of the locals. At the local level, they're saying we want to stand up to the Trump administration, while at the national level, they're basically saying we want primary Democrats and beat them until they look like the type of Democrat we want. Those goals actually sometimes are in sharp contrast and actually will stand in the way of successfully standing up to the Trump administration. Indivisible is launching primaries against incumbent Democrats across the country, not trying to figure out how to win a house majority and take it back from the Republican Party. So, I could go on and on about why I don't think things are likely to get much better anytime soon, but I feel like everyone's searching for rock bottom. Conceivably it exists.
Steve Mistler: You mentioned how the national Indivisible groups where were looking to primary sitting Democrats. Do you feel like that was the issue in drafting (former Democratic Secretary of State) Matt Dunlap to run against you?
Rep. Jared Golden: I have no reason to believe they were in communication, but I could care less.
Steve Mistler: Why do you think you drew a primary challenger? What was going on there? Matt Dunlap is not a progressive Democrat, at least he wasn't before (while in the legislature).
Rep. Jared Golden: Well, he certainly says he is now.
Steve Mistler: Does he say that?
Rep. Jared Golden: He's free to be whatever he wants to be today, no matter what he was in the past.
Steve Mistler: Why do you think that he decided to run against you? My impression is that when you were in the legislature, and he was the Secretary of State, is that you guys had a pretty decent relationship. I don't know how friendly that was, but it at least seemed like you guys didn't have animosity towards one another. What happened?
Rep. Jared Golden: Great question. You should ask Matt that. I haven't talked to him. I think that tells you an awful lot, right? One would have expected a phone call.
Steve Mistler: He didn't even say, hey, look, here's why —
Rep. Jared Golden: I think if you listen to some of his interviews, he'll talk about the SAVE Act (the Republican-led voting bill that angered voting rights groups). I would point out, that he himself was Secretary of State, so he knows this. But the SAVE Act basically reflects the common practice here in the state of Maine. If you are a first time registrant to vote, you're going to have to, in some way or another, prove who you are, what your residency is, and you're going to have to show some ID. I can also tell you from my own internal polling throughout this year that requiring identification to register to vote has like over 70% support in this state, as it does across much of the rest of the country. I think for whatever reason, Matt found himself a good widget there to justify his getting in and making another run for CD-2. He's tried to run for higher office before and come up short in (Democratic) primaries back in (2012). Cynthia Dill won that primary. I think he's thrown his name out and expressed interest in the past. And it should be no surprise that he still has that interest. I don't begrudge him of that.
Steve Mistler: Would you have gotten out of the race if you had no primary challenger?
Rep. Jared Golden: Yes, absolutely. I didn't know that until I knew it. But no matter what anyone thinks, I've not spent much time looking in the rear view mirror on that. I don't mean to be offensive, but I've had very good polling through the years. I've never seen my polls off by more than a point, point and a half, and I leave this primary field with a commanding about 30-plus point lead over Matt Dunlap. If I wanted to win that primary, I would over any contender that I see in the field ... I was fine. But at the end of the day, as I went through the process, I made a decision for myself and my in my family, and also one I think that's good for the people of Maine. And at the end of the day, if you're not feeling like you can give the job 100-110 percent then why not make room for someone else who's going to bring that type of energy? I did this for seven years. It'll be eight by the time I'm done, plus four (years) in the state (legislature). It's a good long period of service.
Steve Mistler: Regardless of whether you thought you would win — and it sounds like you did — that you even had to deal with that obstacle, was that a (factor) at all?
Rep. Jared Golden: The actual campaign itself (was) not something I would have worried too much about. We know what to do. People know who I am at this point. ... I would say that one thing that's changed over the last couple of years is that there is a third of the kind of democratic primary voting, population that is increasingly displeased with me and the way that I go about representing the whole district --that whole district that I put special emphasis on. They are always thinking that the reality that's right there in front of them is somehow not true. They've just become more and more militant. If you ask them, they will tell you that Democrats don't like me anymore. And yet, two thirds of the primary voting population are pleased with the job that I've done. They understand my pragmatism. They understand the need to actually win Republican votes in order to win and represent the district. There are 32,000 more registered Republicans than Democrats (in the 2nd Congressional District). And this one third increasingly just doesn't want to believe any of that. They think there's a bunch of magical, invisible Democrats out there to turnout and that you can win without relying on Republican support. That's not going to happen. But that one third is very personal and negative about other Democrats, such as myself, and the governing decisions that we make. Basically (they) say that I aid and abet fascists and fascism, that I am helping to dismantle American democracy. And sometimes they're the most threatening and negative and frankly vile themselves, which they say they hate about MAGA and Donald Trump. So some part of me says to them, 'Go look in the mirror and see the example you set for today's youth.'
Kevin Miller: That seems like a good segue into ... your (2024 Bangor Daily News column) saying that President Trump is going to win and that you were okay with it. That, to outside observers, seems like kind of a pivotal moment in your relationship with some of the Democrats here in the state and maybe the national Democrats as well.
Rep. Jared Golden: On the contrary, nationally, I'm more popular than I have ever been. National Democrats like that I win. They like that I am holding the reddest seat of any Democrat in the entire country to include the United States Senate. I think they see in me and my team something to be replicated in order to win majorities and actually hold them.
Kevin Miller: Were you surprised at the way it landed with the Democrats here in in Maine? You accused Democrats of pearl clutching, and you talked about Democrats using scare tactics in suggesting that Donald Trump was a threat to democracy. So were you surprised at the reaction to that here in Maine among Democrats?
Rep. Jared Golden: I guess I would point out that I was right. Donald Trump won the election. He also won the national popular vote. And I think that it was fair to point out that a party that was running on an election message that we, the party, would save democracy from Donald Trump, who was deemed a threat to democracy, was totally failing to resonate with enough people to win the election, right? So over half of the voting population didn't agree that the man was a threat to democracy. Or does that third of Dems that I'm talking about actually believe that half the country knowingly voted for someone who would destroy democracy? You know, there's all kinds of people that will tell me right now, with certainty in their in their eyes and voice, that President Trump must be plummeting (in the 2nd Congressional District). On Election Day, he won the district by nine and a half points his favorability among voters was about 48 percent. When I last polled the district in October, he was up to about 52 percent favorability. That means he is more popular today in (the district) among all likely voters than he was on Election Day (in 2024). I just don't believe that that 52 percent of people that have a favorable view of him actually believe that he's taking away their freedom or destroying their democracy. I'm not looking at him, I'm looking at them. I'm trying to see through their eyes and see what they see and figure out what it is that they want. ? In my column, I simply said that if Joe Biden chooses to run, he's going to lose to Donald Trump. And I didn't say I would be okay with that. I said American democracy would be okay. And I still believe that. Why? Because I don't think the American people are going to put up with a dictatorship. I'm most concerned about the corruption.
Kevin Miller: Corruption in the Trump administration?
Rep. Jared Golden: Absolutely, just lining their pockets in so many ways. You can call it soft corruption, whatever you want, but they are finding any way they can to bring profits, either into the president's family or just into his circle in general. I hate that, right? But, you know, corruption is a political problem no matter who's in the White House and something that should always be taken seriously. There's no doubt that I think this administration is doing well at it unfortunately.
Steve Mistler: I want to talk a little bit more about, like your assessment of the Trump administration in a bit, but I don't want to leave the (column) because I want to ask just a basic question about it. What were you trying to achieve by writing that?
Rep. Jared Golden: If you looked at the campaign, you would have seen that I basically was just the same guy that I always am. Honestly, after (President Biden's debate performance against Trump), there wasn't a day that I went anywhere that I didn't have a member of the press trying to force me to make some kind of statement about whether or not Joe Biden should be the nominee, if he should run for reelection. I could see that conversation would continue forever until I answered the question, and that even if Joe Biden decided to step down, that the press would just be all over me to say, well, now who? So frankly, it was just a response to the press to say, I'm not going to do 100 different interviews and talk about this 100 different ways, here you go. It's Joe Biden's decision whether or not to run for reelection, but I think if he chooses to run, he's going to lose. But I also was kind of suggesting ... to my own party, 'Listen in this moment, you still get a chance to pivot to a message about the economy, about affordability, about how we will govern the country more effectively than we did when we had full control ... let's talk about the things that win elections. And instead, the party continued to make it about the threat to democracy. And we lost. And I am okay with that, because I support democracy and when 50-plus percent of people vote for someone, then you know, that's who won the election. And you've got to move on.
Kevin Miller: There are still a sizable number of Democrats out there who think that Donald Trump is trying to destroy democracy. Some of the things that we've seen in the past 10 months, you know, the masked ICE agents without identification, swooping up people off the street, including US citizens; him suggesting that members of Congress should be executed for treason because ... they are pointing out that members of the military are obligated to disobey an illegal order. Do you have any concerns that he might be making changes that would be damaging to our democracy?
Rep. Jared Golden: I have faith in the American people and in the institutions that we have. And I think in the face of someone who will do almost anything that they can to get away with what's in their best -- because the President is very focused on what's best for him, above even what's best for the country ... If you give him an inch, I think he'll take a mile. Our job is not to give the inch, to make sure that the institution and the checks and balances are being put into play with full force. But I think that we'll be just fine on the other end of it.
Kevin Miller: You think those checks and balances are being applied in full force right now?
Rep. Jared Golden: I think the courts are very active on an almost daily basis. We're going to win some. We're going to lose some. I think that finally we're starting to see a little bit of spine in the Congress in the last month or so. I think that the President's agenda gets tougher moving forward.
Steve Mistler: You alluded to your concerns about corruption and self enrichment. Is that the thing that bothers you the most about the presidency, this administration?
Rep. Jared Golden: In the final analysis, I think defying the courts, refusing to implement the laws that Congress has made is a big deal. But I've tried to point out to people that defending the institutions means allowing them to go through, you know, the full thorough process. So, when there's a court ruling, and then the (Department of Justice is appealing), I'm not going to run out and say, 'You see, this is evidence right here that democracy is coming to an end.' You know, they're, they're going to play that process right through the Supreme Court. When they start openly defying the Supreme Court, that's, that's a much bigger and more concerning thing.
Kevin Miller: You've been very critical of the the left wing of the Democratic Party. You seem to suggest at times that you feel like that far left wing is driving a lot of the decisions that are being made, or at least what's coming out of Washington. Where do you see the party being in 5-10 years?
Rep. Jared Golden: I have no clue. Kevin. You know, I think if you just start with gerrymandering and the fact that there's really only 20 to 30 truly competitive House seats in the general election, then you will be on the trail to seeing that one of the strongest points of leverage in the Congress on both sides of the aisle is the fear of primaries. Most members that are there, unlike myself, live in the greatest fear of being primaried.
Kevin Miller: I mean, that's certainly the perception. But from someone who's a member of Congress, that actually is true, that one of the greatest fears of a member of Congress is being primaried?
Rep. Jared Golden: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I'm kind of shocked. I even have to reconfirm that. People are living in fear of those primaries. The reality of the Democratic party today, and not at all dissimilar from the Republican Party, is it's more like a coalition. We are like maybe four, possibly five factions, some of whom are almost irreconcilable with the others at this point. And that's true in the Republican Party. There are probably two to three different strong factions there. I've been trying to say to the party for the last year, accept the fact that we are this group of factions, that we are not one party, stop warring with each other for full control of the party and its future, and just learn how to govern together. And then maybe we would be focused enough such that we could win elections together as well. But if we continue down that road, I don't think one (faction) is anywhere near strong enough to dominate over the over the others. Certainly some are stronger or weaker, but I don't see anyone who's got an electorate within that coalition that is going to lead to future dominance. I think this kind of infighting and battling with each other continues unless everyone decides to work together. And that's ... to say nothing about trying to govern with other parties.
Kevin Miller: I almost hesitate to ask this, but it has been brought up in the past. Do you still consider yourself a Democrat? There are some suggestions that maybe you would change to be an Independent at some point.
Rep. Jared Golden: Well, if I were going to do that, I would have done it, right? But how does what I was saying tie back to the the gerrymandering and the fear primaries? Well, I think it's fair to say that the more progressive, far left element of that coalition is more dominant in social media among certain type elite culture setting entities in Democratic politics. And so, they do have a little more momentum there. But they're not able to seal the deal because they're not as competitive in the general election where there's a whole different electorate that you have to deal with. And that's a a countervailing force. They're very powerful in that primary setting in not all, but most, regions right now. But I don't know what the future will look like because eventually people do have an expectation of winning and winning majorities and then setting the agenda for the country. So they're going to have pressure to deliver here if they have a very successful primary season.
Steve Mistler: I want to just circle back real quick to ... your critiques of the of the of the Democratic Party, both parties, really. What does that mean for somebody like you? Do you have any ambitions to come back to public service? Would you like to be governor someday? As you know, having been in the state legislature, you can actually get something done in that position. And that seems to be a problem that you've identified in getting out of Congress, is that it's just difficult to produce meaningful results for your constituents. That would not be as much of a problem if you were to be governor.
Rep. Jared Golden: It is important to me that when I am doing something that that I feel like there are prospects to go hard for what I believe is right. And often I feel like the party, because of how broken Congress is, tries to just kind of tinker around the edges of what is wrong with our economy, with the way the government is set up and structured --you know, kind of put like little band aids on things, when really I think we need some smashing and some aggressive change, to try some new things. And when I think about the state of Maine, I think that there's a real need for someone to be governor and for a legislature who would be willing to really go big and try some different things — not sticking with the status quo of the last, let's say, 40 years. Not to pick on the Mills administration or the LePage administration. I'm just saying broadly that I think we need to really flip the table here, reset the pieces, and try some big new things. And in talking with some friends over the last couple of years about how aggressive might I be if I were governor, you kind of like realize that the status quo is pretty happy with itself in many ways. And it's easy to get into the legislature and look at those different factions and the tensions existing within them, and just kind of, you know, crack and frack, and the next thing you know you're fighting with your own majorities. The elements of the other party have no incentive to work with you because they're going to surely try and beat you in just a couple of election cycles. So, it's questionable just how much you can get done unless you just want to tinker, which I'm not interested in doing. But to answer your question more forcefully, I guess just or more clearly, I still have a lot of passion for politics and care about the state and about the country, and I am not at all planning on running for anything again in the future. But some of my mentors through the years have said don't take things off the table because you just don't know. There's no masterful plan for the next five, 10, 20 years in my life, other than getting a good, hard focus on the on the family.
Steve Mistler: You mentioned your family. I want to talk about another part of your rationale for getting out of the race, and that's political violence, threats to your family. I was stunned to read that detail (in your column about not seeking reelection) about spending Thanksgiving in a hotel room somewhere because of a threat to your home. I can't imagine what that's like and I'm sorry that you had to go through that. A situation like that is unfathomable to a lot of people. I don't have a good sense of how often you've been threatened. We don't have a window into that and that's why I'm asking that question. How bad is it? And how much of that played into your decision not to run again?
Rep. Jared Golden: There's a story told about a World War II vet in "Band of Brothers", where he on the plane and about to jump into Normandy, and someone says, 'half of you aren't going to make it back from this mission.' And he jokingly says to the guy sitting to his left and right, 'Well, it's been nice knowing you two suckers.' Which is kind of human nature, right, the assumption that those things aren't going to happen to me. But I think that it's become very clear to lawmakers around the country in both parties that there is a growing and very real threat. It's pretty hard to ignore. In the last year, we've seen state lawmakers (in Minnesota) being assassinated because of national politics, two attempts on the President, the terrible shooting of Charlie Kirk on a live feed for all the nation to see. I think it's getting harder for people to go on with that kind of good-natured, naive assumption that it won't be you. I haven't wanted the press to overly focus on this. In regards to myself, I obviously was willing to die for the country in Afghanistan and Iraq as a young man. I have done this job for seven years, despite the threats which have existed since the beginning. But you know, the kind of frequency, the kind of tenor of them has grown along with the national reach of them as I've become more of a known figure. And I think what's important to remember is that the responsibilities have changed. I now have two young girls with my wife, Isobel. And some of the threats are made against them, not against me. That'll hit home. I don't think I overreact. I'm not very dramatic. And yet, I've taken the threat seriously enough through the years that I've escalated my own security circle from starting to carry (a firearm) for self protection, to, you know, getting bigger guns, more effective ones, to taking security measures around the house and in my (congressional) operations. .... Even an event like at Colby College, or or where people are having town halls, it's just like, are folks really thinking about the security? ... Not just thinking about themselves, but the safety of the community around them? These are really serious threats. Unfortunately, the security measures being taken are are necessary. And I think people should just think long and hard about that, because it is also a threat to to our democracy, perhaps more than any one individual in elected office could ever be. You know, this mindset that we are warring with one another over politics is perhaps most concerning to me.
Kevin Miller: I really appreciate your your candor on on on that topic. And we're obviously going to have more time to talk to you ... so I'm not gonna ask you to recap all your accomplishments over the past seven years. But I do want to touch on one that just happened recently. You pulled off the rarest of rare accomplishments in the House with the discharge petition (for a bill restoring collective bargaining rights for federal workers). You were able to do an end run around House Speaker Mike Johnson get Democrats and Republicans on board to take an initial step towards reinstating collective bargaining for federal workers. How big of a deal was it to be able to accomplish that?
Rep. Jared Golden: It was a rare success, and it was done in an extremely rare way. I see in that the years of work and establishing credibility across the aisle. You know, I've gotten to a place now that if there are people in the Congress who are working on some kind of compromise, House Republicans will want to see me in the room, or perhaps question whether this is really a deal in the making. If that makes sense. Because they know that once I've kind of shaken hands with them on something I'm going to stick to it, and I'm not afraid and I'll try and create space for that to actually get done and become law. Things aren't finished just because you pass it out of the House. So (Rep.) Brian Fitzpatrick and I aren't done on that, and we're going to take our work to the Senate and in the new year. Whether it's fighting for the collective bargaining rights of federal employees or trying to restore them, or the ACA subsidies ...
Kevin Miller: Which you are also working on with Brian Fitzpatrick, a Republican from Pennsylvania ...
Rep. Jared Golden: Correct. Perhaps more quietly, we started a discharge petition on a Fitzpatrick-Golden bill that is almost identical to the deal that is being talked about by those 20 senators who are working on some type of deal. I think it's fair to say that a three year extension (of ACA subsidies) is not getting through United States Senate. So, you know, I think Brian and I will be working hard on that in in the Senate as soon as we get back to Congress in January. But it felt good to know that the relationships I built can lead me to a place where I can get some big things done in a very unusual way, kind of historic way. Some of the unions have been very appreciative, but I've let them know I'm not happy until they get their rights back.
Kevin Miller: Do you feel like now that you're not running for reelection, does that give you even more leverage potentially to work with Republicans? Are they going to come to you even more often because now they don't have to worry about giving you a win that you might be able to use in the election?
Rep. Jared Golden: Well, I certainly got nothing to lose, and I'm going to go for broke on all my priorities in the next year, which are, they're priorities for Maine and for the people I represent. A lot of them are the same issues I've been working on for years ... but I'd like to get a little bit more done here in the year ahead. So nothing to lose. Just going to do what I think is right. Should be fun.
Steve Mistler: I know that when you were first elected campaign finance reform was huge deal to you.
Rep. Jared Golden: Massive.
Steve Mistler: Is it impossible to get anything done on that front? You talk about being able to go for broke now. There's a real sense out there that something's got to change in our campaign finance system.
Rep. Jared Golden: The public gets it. And I think they're kind of in on the joke too, because not only do they get that it's corrosive to our politics and just the way that it's practiced. But I hear so many people say, 'How does all these billions of dollars get spent and create such crappy ads that don't even speak to me at all? Like, how can you spend $100 million trying to convince me that someone sucks and you've basically left me feeling cynical about you? It's almost like rallying around, you know, the person who's getting clubbed. It is a massive diminishing return on on investment being made in political advertisement and spending. And yet, the data will also show you that if you don't contest the space, it will do damage to you. As long as you're just kind of like meeting it with even force, then it's rather ineffective at changing the (election) outcomes. But if you're massively outspent, then it can really hurt you. So members of Congress spend tons of time raising money. And it's a terrible waste of time. No one seems happy about it. I don't know who the big beneficiaries are, but except those with the greatest means to give have the strongest influence over the over the system as a whole. In that way ... the billionaire class is able to use all these loopholes to spend limitless amounts of unaccountable money. I think it's disgusting. And I think it's a massive piece of everything that's going wrong with the political discussion in this country. I like what some countries do. I think it's like France. They they have very short campaigns by law, right? Like, you can't start advertising until a certain date just a few months before election day. And then 30 days before election day, they do a market blackout. I just don't know why it takes this much. Some of the old timers don't realize just how much has changed in the last 15 years. I had one member of Congress --nice guy -- say, 'Oh, I had a really expensive race this last cycle.' This was in 2023. I said, 'Well, how much got spent?' He said, like, $4 million. My last (election) here was $48 million right? Which is ridiculous.
Steve Mistler: And that's not even a full accounting, because some of this money is spent in ways that can't even be tracked.
Rep. Jared Golden: I could tell you one thing I didn't sign up for, and didn't realize. Maybe I was a little naive to it. (It's) just how powerful television and advertisement is. I didn't know I was going to become, you know, like a household name. I'm now sitting around over 90% name and face (identification) around the state. I didn't see that coming and I don't particularly love it. I've been willing to kind of live with it to do the work, but I hope people understand that that was never something I really wanted. And I'm not feeling bad for myself. But it just never really occurred to me that that was going to happen. And who knew? Because it wasn't long ago, the (2nd District) races were $2-3 million of total spending. (Former Rep. Mike Michaud's) races were kind of in that category. And it's quickly just exploded in the face of (the U.S. Supreme Court's 'Citizens United' decision)and everything that's followed in last 15 years. It's out of control. I don't know how to rein it in. Other than .... stop paying attention to the dumb ads. We always tried to have ours be as positive as we could. I always wanted to say, 'Let's spend like, nine out of every $10 talking about what we've got to offer.'
Steve Mistler: I know that you've already said you're not going to endorse Matt Dunlap. Is there anybody that you would recommend?
Rep. Jared Golden: I've had a lot of conversations with people who are thinking about running for office. I think a lot of times people think that the party apparatus is just all powerful and will just come in and if they decide that you're good they're just gonna, like, dump this infrastructure in place and you're just gonna have a magical campaign operation with tons of money. And that's just not how it works, right? And actually, that's good. ... I'll tell you what I will tell all the others. It's going to be hard work. And that hard work will grow your political muscle such that you might be more competitive in the general election against (former Gov.) Paul LePage. I don't think I would have beaten (former Republican U.S. Rep.) Bruce Poliquin in 2018 if I hadn't had a competitive primary field to contest with.
Steve Mistler: And you didn't have establishment backing in that primary either ...
Rep. Jared Golden: No, but you know, like the House doesn't do that as much as ... the Senate. I mean, for Christsakes, I don't know what the (Democratic National Committee) does. I don't know if I've even spoken to anyone who's associated with the DNC in 12 years of elected office. But I'm not throwing out names. I think the people that decide to put their name out there have to come to that, you know, for their own reasons. I guess what I am telling my colleagues in Washington is that I think it's important that we win a Democratic majority in the next election in the House of Representatives. I'm a little more skeptical that the Senate map is favorable (to Democrats), but at least divided rule and a little bit of power and leverage in Democratic hands would be good for the country. So I'm just going to give them really hard-nosed advice about where to spend their resources. And that's going to be a combination of the instincts that I've developed through the years, my finger on the pulse of the (district), which has come through 43 years of life. And knowing what data to actually look at and how to actually read it. So I've always told folks, if you do everything the party tells you, and the polls say that you're going to lose, they'll cut bait and let you drown on your own in a heartbeat. ... But if you can win, they'll get behind you in the final push, right? But everything that comes before that, you got to earn it yourself.
Steve Mistler: Well, thanks for taking the time and giving us so much of it. This won't be the last conversation, but I'm glad that you carved out a little bit before, especially before for the holiday, too. So appreciate that.
Rep. Jared Golden: Thank you.
